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Silverfoxesclub-digest In this issue: -Gay handicap (20)
---------------------------------------------------------------------- Howdy! Ben and group: I have been enrolled with the group for several weeks and I have been monitoring it and have enjoyed everyone's comments plus the photos as well! I don't think that I am considered a newbie. My questions as follows: Why in the Personal Ads that some people say that they are in a Open Relationship with a person and seeking Sex with someone else? Why do some some people only want a short term relationship not a long one? Is there any groups that cater to the Gay handicapped and or Gay disabled that a person can check out? In my roaming around in person or surf the Internet that I have found that some Gays shun the Gay handicapped or Gay disabled. My personal opinion is that they are human and Gay too and have no quams or different feeling about them. They are human and have feelings as well. I do treat with respect and fairiness and courtesy! I was Medical Social Worker for 25 years and retired now. I treat anyone the same as the other person that didn't have limitations as well. I treat people like, I like to be treated. I have several Gay friends that are disabled and or handicapped and I am trying to get information for them so I can get back to them and in hopes that they will have a contacts and feel better and get on with their life in general. We all live in this world so I figure that it would be a far better world. If people would be kinder, caring, courteous, understanding and a better life and sharing. I make a point to say"Hi" when I see a person in this situation as it boost their morale and makes them feel like a human and I spend a little time with them.l Yesteryears! If you were over 25 years old. Younger Gays wouldn't give you the time of the day unless you could be taken advantage somehow. Now the younger Gays are starting to think different. Give a little time of assistance or a little of your time and things look much brighter. You might think that you'll never be disabled or handicapped but it could happen today or tomorrow or whenever! We never know! This I wanted to get this off my chest.Guess that I have babbled enough. Have a very nice day!
Bud I concur with these statements and as a new member for two weeks, I ask the same questions to myself but I am not here to judge anyone or their intimate involvement. On the question asked of why those who have an "Open relationship" and is only seeking sex, if the sex is not good or variety is needed with the person you are presently with, why do stay committed? Have you conveyed it to the other individual? More so, is the situation honest?
Regards, ewokebearone wrote: Why (do) some people say that they are in an Open Relationship.... The answer to these questions are pretty clear, Ewoke. Very few males are monogamous in nature and Homo sapiens is just another sexy primate. Males tend to be less monogamous than women though in many species females are as polygamous as in Homo. As to the short term relationship, I suspect some people don't want emotional attachments which do happen with frequency. I am involved in several relationships, most of them casual but repeating, with people who live all over though mostly in TX. One at least I hope will be a permanent part of my life, though I don't expect the relationship to ever be primary, since we are both definitely tops and while we do have sex, we also fuck other men regularly. In fact one of my fantasies is sharing a sexy butch bottom with my boy. Is there any groups that cater to the Gay handicapped and or Gay disabled that a person can check out?
I really don't have any idea but there are some men
who definitely get a special erection for the
handicapped or disabled, so there must be. I'm not
particularly attracted to disabled as disabled but
there's a newspaperman in Alpine TX in a wheelchair
who always makes MY cock hard, but lacking any
evidence as to his sexual tastes, I haven't acted on
it. He's charmng and handsome and sexy and friendly
and I wish I knew, I wish I knew. I've never made
love nor had sex with anyone that severely disabled,
but in his case I certainly would.
Fitz: Sexual monogamy is one. It maybe somewhat more difficult to sustain this kind of relationship in all its "purity". The general gay world seems to be built on the availibility of free sex. Even in the str8t world, adultery is not uncommon. Nevertheless, I think this kind of relationship is viable, if the two partners heartily agree. The inclusion of another or others for 3 or more somes is a variation among some sexually monogamous couples. These may be allowed within certain negotiated guidelines. Open but committed relationships are more common among gay men. This generally means that one or both partners can engage sexually with others but that the central, abiding relationship is the "committed" one. It is a question where one's loyalty and devotion finally lie. Open, casual relationships allow one or both partners to engage sexually with others. Unlike open but committed relationships, the central relationship is not necessarily the abiding or a permanent one. It is somewhat more tentative and even utilitarian in nature. Relationships can go in and out of various permutations, depending on the partners. My own relationship of 20 years at my instigation recently moved from being sexually monogamous to being "open but committed". It was a long process of talking together, being reasonable, negotiating our parameters, and a sense of security and just plain love. Of course, the presence of HIV infection is ever possible, complicates the equations and must be taken into account. For me, it is not just my life, but that of my partner, Steve, that I have chosen to be responsible for...
However a couple choses to live their relationship at one point in
time, we, hopefully, can honor it.
Relationships are pretty various among gay guys. Unlike the so-called straight world which seems to offer only two types of relationships, married and unmarried, gay men can explore different permutations. Sexual monogamy is one. It maybe somewhat more difficult to sustain this kind of relationship in all its "purity". The general gay world seems to be built on the availibility of free sex. Even in the str8t world, adultery is not uncommon. Nevertheless, I think this kind of relationship is viable, if the two partners heartily agree. The inclusion of another or others for 3 or more somes is a variation among some sexually monogamous couples. These may be allowed within certain negotiated guidelines. I am going to try to respond with as open a mind as possible for this old man.. I DO NOT understand why it is so hard for two men to have a committed MONOGAMOUS Relationship,I just wish someone out there could give one good honest answer to that question,Minus of course all the mumbo-jumbo that usually comes accompanied with the "man is not ment to be monagamous,or he is free to plant his seeds anywhere" nonsense. Leaving the church and legalities out of all this,Cant a man honestly love another man for a lifetime without needing to dip his dick into every mouth and butt that gets pointed at him?? Is it the words love and honor, that scares an otherwise intellegent man to outside sex?? Is it true that Gay people are so sex crazed without knowing it that they cant have a true committed relationship without straying.. I think it is possible and has happened many times,But all I ever hear on not just this fine list but on all of them makes me think I must have lived my life in another world or on another planet, I lived just such a relationship for 54yrs and could not have been happier,But I think the secret is not the sex but honest and sincere love and careing..And this I think is what divides the gay masses,It isnt all about the cock its about the heart.. I honestly dont want to offend anyone,and if I do I apologize,But dear God, No one was put on this earth for the soul reason of sexual gratification alone..Although I know following all the gay mailing lists for several years,I am beginning to think an awful lot of people think thats why they are here... Sincere apologies for any stepped on toes or feelings I have ruffled ...I shall post no more on this subject as I fear it truly does nothing to change what is anymore.
Sexy Grey Senior
Dear Sexy: [Sex, while we are defined and define ourselves by it, may not have the same meaning as it might among heterosexuals...but that's another thread. Thrashing our thinking on gay relationships, "not that one might win over the other, but that the truth be revealed..." is another.]
Eric
Jack:
Good luck on your relationships... I hope all you guys out there don't think that all of us youngsters 'have the time to be cruel'. I certainly do NOT fall into that category. I know a lot of other younger people who love being around older men (disabled or not!), and even know a couple of them who have disabled partners (wheelchair, blind, limbs missing, mental problems, etc.) so just because you don't see us out there lobbying congress for more money doesn't mean we do not exist. I, myself, find men of color to be extremely attractive--even though I have never had sex with an older black man, I wouldn't turn him down if I ever did find one. It seems to me that there aren't any old black gay men. I have never met one. I also like Asians, Hispanics, Europeans... I still find it saddening to listen to some of you (older) guys out there that have been hurt by a younger person before. Please do not generalize us all that way. Some of us truly do worship the ground you walk on. While I'm here I might as well add that some of you older guys seem to "sour" over time, I don't know if it happens to all of us as we age or what, but I certainly will try my best not to turn out this way. You seem to convince yourself that nobody loves you or wants to be with you--all I can say is if you don't give a person a chance to talk to you, you will never find out! Learn how to give chances, don't turn your back on anybody that is interested in talking with you--you just might be losing out on the best thing that ever happened to you!
David
"James Young" wrote:
Dear Jim,
George of Boston (Boston Bill)
Dave: It's the happy task of the younger to prove them wrong...
Eric SexyGreySenior@aol.com wrote: I DO NOT understand why it is so hard for two men to have a committed MONOGAMOUS Relationship..... Well, it is a fact that in the animal world the key to survival is to reproduce as much as possible. The more offspring produced the greater the chances of that species continuing down generations. Obviously gay men cannot reproduce in the traditional sense, at least not until it becomes possible for a male to become pregnant! However, we are still males and have that primal instinct in us that gives us the desire to have sex. Remember, that is the whole purpose of sex - to reproduce and continue the survival of the species by the male impregnating as many fertile females as possible. Of course, when it comes to gay sex then the reproduction aspect no longer makes any sense. However, we still have that primal male urge within us except we desire sex with men and not women. In my opinion there is nothing wrong with either an 'open' (free to have sex with others) or 'closed' (monogamous) relationship. It's entirely dependant on the couple concerned and what works best for them. I know many couples in 'open' relationships, and it is this fact that keeps them together. Their love is for each other, but to satisfy their lust they are free to have sex with other men. There are limits and rules obviously, but they still have a total commitment to each other. Some peoples sex drives are stronger than others, and without the ability to satisfy these urges then the relationship will become strained. Now some people prefer a monogamous/ closed relationship. That is fine, as some people don't have the urge to go and have sex with many different men. BUT, there are many so called 'monogamous' relationships out there that aren't quite what they seem. I for one know many guys who are in closed relationships but have sex with other men behind their partners back. I'm single, and a very large percentage of guys that I have had fun with are in supposedly 'closed' relationships. Too many times I have been told 'I already have a boyfriend, please don't tell anyone'. Always seemed that when I thought I'd found the man of my dreams it turned out that he was already taken. Surely it would be better for people to have an 'open' relationship and be honest with their partners rather than masquerading as a monogamous couple? Far better than sneaking sex with other men behind their partners back which one heck of a lot do. Personally I think that many of those in an 'open' relationship show more trust and respect for their partners in comparison to those in a 'closed' relationship. Quite often some relationships are closed due to jealousy and possessiveness by one partner. Sooner or later the suppressed partner will be tempted to stray..... There are, of course, many monogamous relationships out there that are true to each other. If that's what makes them happy, then fine. Just as much as there are many 'open' relationships out there whereby both partners love each other but also enjoy having sex with other men. Of course in an open relationship absolute care has to be taken to have safe sex so as not to run the risk of passing on STI's. If safe sex is practised then the risks are very low. Personally I think I would prefer to have the 'open' relationship option. I would always have the love and respect for my partner but would also be able to indulge in some 'fun' when need be. I would of course expect my partner to have the same options too. But there must be respect for each other, and limits must be understood. My final thought is that whether a relationship is to be open or closed is entirely dependant on the individuals concerned. Maybe with a certain type of silver fox I would be happy to be in a closed relationship, but maybe with another I'll be happy to be open. As long as we love, care and respect each other then that is all I am concerned about.
Hugs to you all, Simple answer - Sex and love are not the same thing. I know my partner loves me, and if he's attracted to someone else for sex, he has my blessing, as I have his. I am absolutely confident that I won't be dumped because of some pretty ass. After all, we don't live in a soap-opera.
Killer David Cantu wrote: I hope all you guys out there don't think...all of us youngsters...to be cruel'..... That was a bit unfair to younger men. While there are younger men who are rude about turning down men who don't appeal to them, there are older men just as rude. And older men are as likely to be trapped into a narrow frame of reference of sexual attraction. I actually am most turned on by men from about 45 to 6o and have been since I was about 14. However, many of them have gone to pot or are out searching for the 20 somethings and not interested in other men their own ages. That's the way it is. Some young men only want other young men. Some young men only want older men. As long as men are polite that's fine. I consider myself lucky in having a broad range of tastes in both age and race. David: I...find men of color to be extremely attractive..... I wrote to Bi-men-Texas about an older black man once, who I suspect is no longer with us or is perhaps no longer physically active. He lived in Austin and was as beautiful physically as anyone I ever saw. He had an oversized cock and only went for men of middle age or older because he said (and was probably right) that it took a lot of practice to suck it right. As I could even eventually get it all into my mouth and throat he always welcomed me. I went to the video shop in east Austin where I used to see him once, back in the days when it was sexually active and he was fending off a remarkably good looking young man of 25 or less, perhaps a UTA student, who wanted him badly. I asked him to let the boy join us and maybe he could learn from watching me. The boy got naked and on his knees beside and played with the gorgeous daddies heavy balls while I sucked his cock, gradually increasing the depth to which I took it. Not long after I got it completely in my mouth and throat, with his balls tight against my beard and my throat muscles playing with the head of the uncut handsome meat, he shot an enormous load into my mouth. The boy was fascinated and hot as hell. I told the black man to stay where he was, to put his feet on the seat beside his hips and lean back to give the boy access to the still firm cock, back and asshole and gradually worked my cock into the boy's tight hot ass. While I fucked him, he learned to rim the black daddy. When the boy finally shot his wad against the front of the man's seat, not jacking off, using his hands on the balls and belly of the black man he was rimming, it triggered my orgasm, filling a condom full almost to over flowing. After I pulled out and removed the condom I poured the cum into the boy's mouth. We all had a lot of fun and the boy was as good a piece of as as I've ever had. But the black daddy has disappeared and I would like to have another like him...or a younger black man. OUt where I live there are few blacks. David: ....Some of us (youngers) truly do worship the ground you walk on....
It's also true that most of the men who hit on me are
mid 20's to mid 30's and some of them are sexy as hell
and either skilled already or prepared to learn. If I
weren't into many types my sex life would be much less
than it is. My main requirements are masculinity and
cleanliness. For regular repeats, brains are
necessary, but for an occasional fuck, nice bodies
will do.
Hi Geo & Guys Hugs, Ron
P.S. from Ben Boxer: Our relation ship is happy and open and will continue so.I am 79 and he is 73.But he prefers to listen to music or read a book,than thrash about on a bed. but understands my needs,as I understand his. he has not for the last 8 years or so,ever wanted sex. And I love him,and I know he loves me.
hugs to all Leslie
Chas: He may not be in relationship with one central guy but he has relationships. The "single" relationship fosters a kind of family relationship with others--they may be fun sex, but they may also become friends. Friendship, always important to gay people is very important for the "single gay guy." "Fuck-buddies" are friends who enjoy one another sexually and may be intimate by all definitions of the term, but don't want/need THIS person as a committed partner. It's a category that has no direct correspondance in the str8t world though there may be superficial resemblences to the man & mistress model--though the dynamics are very different, IMHO. Like running your own business, the single life may not be for everyone. I admire the "single guys" who happily live this life by choice...
Eric I have been reading these messages with strong interest, and haven't responded yet. I am in a monogamous relationship. We have been together for 27 years. Six years ago, my partner suffered kidney failure. He was on dialysis for 3 years and then received a transplant from his older sister. Both the dialysis and the medications to prevent rejection have rendered him sexless. He has also developed goutic arthritis which makes even a touch painful. We are still very much partners. But, how can I deal with my strong sexual needs without going outside of the relationship?
Reinhardt
Dear Friend, But I am very pleased that we can disagree without being disagreeable to each other, and that we can continue to respect each other while in disagreement.
That is a sign of some maturity in both of us.
Thank you for demonstrating that.
George of Boston (Boston Bill) RUSTYCAL@aol.com wrote: I personally want my life-partner to be happy, and have no problem with him having sex with someone else.
Yes, Rusty,
That is called love, not possessiveness.
George of Boston (Boston Bill)
Reinhardt: Talk to the man...and see what happens. He needs to know. You need to know. Give him the chance to care.
Ama et fac quod vis--Augustine
Eric
George: Respect for differing opinions is very important, particularly since we rely on a written medium which imperfectly comminicates our points or opinions. We don't have the visual clues which provide other clues of how we interpret what we are saying. Of course, we can still be jerks in our views about things, but then, what else are lists for? :>)
Eric End of silverfoxesclub-digest V1 #231
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