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In this issue:
-72 great things about being gay (3)
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1. You understand the immense importance of good lighting.
Dear Luvhog,
PS I do know a totally straight guy who can say fabulous
and get away with it - well, we all take the piss out of him, but he does
get away with it. Just a reminder, there have been many influences in the culture at large for centuries on centuries that were initiated by gay men, e.g words like fabulous:
The art of Michaelangelo and De Vinci
Byron
From: "luvhog" luvhog@ameritech.net
Dentists do it orally Remember my case with the hotel that wouldn't accept me and Harley? Well, we settled. I am somewhat disappointed in the settlement, but the hotel refused to go higher, and these cases don't give big settlements, because blind people in our society aren't respected enough so that when our rights are violated most don't give a hoot. The hotel has to put up signage welcoming guide dogs, and they are supposed to be given sensitivity training. The cash amount is $3,000. I had wanted much more, as the hotel had been contacted by three people to try to explain the law, and one was a prominent blind lawyer. However, had I not settled, the case would have dragged on for another 12 to 18 months, and the hotel might have managed to get out of paying anything; a lot depends on the judge you have. So, I told Mass Commission against Discrimination that I'd settle, and am waiting for the papers. I wish I felt better about it, but I don't because it almost seems a hollow victory, and I think it put a lot of stress on a new friendship; who wants a friend that can't even rent a room in a hotel without a hassle! Thanks to those of you who did contact me and who, by your kind words, showed you understood.
Bob and Harley The upswing, Bob, is that they've since changed their policy to allow guide dogs, and are getting sensitivity training on top of that... I'd say it's a huge victory! Imagine... The next person who visits their hotel will be greeted warmly, as will their guide dog... Hooray!
------------------------------ A man walked into a supermarket with his zipper down. A lady cashier walked up to him and said, "Your barracks door is open." This is not a phrase we men normally use so he went on his way looking a bit puzzled. When he was about done shopping, a man came up and said,"Your fly is open." He zipped up and finished his shopping. He then intentionally got in the line to check out where the lady was that told him about his "barracks door." He was planning to have a little fun with her. When he reached her counter, he said, "When you saw my barracks door open did you see a soldier standing in there at attention?" The lady thought for a moment and
said, "No,
no. I didn't. All I saw was a disabled veteran sitting on two duffel
bags!!!
Dear Abby: My father and mother have recently been arrested for growing and selling marijuana and are currently dependent on my other two sisters who are prostitutes in Jersey City. I have two brothers. One is currently serving a non-parole life sentence in Attica for murder of a teenage boy in 1994. The other brother is currently being held in the Wellington Remand Center on charges of neglecting his three children. I have recently become engaged to marry a former Thai prostitute who lives in the Bronx and, indeed, is still a part- time "working girl" in a brothel. Her time there is limited, however, as we hope to open our own brothel with her as the working manager. I am hoping my two sisters would be interested in joining our team. Although I would prefer them not to prostitute themselves, it would get them off the street, and, hopefully, the heroin. My problem is this: I love my fiancee and look forward to bringing her into the family, and of course, I want to be totally honest with her. Should I tell her about my cousin who voted for George Bush?
Signed, Worried About My Reputation
just came across this purported Irish Proverb. Thought it appropriate for
this list: What would you think if your domestic partner told you he was not physically attracted to you but fell in love with you because he liked you as a person? This question came up in conversation recently and I thought I would share it with the group. It happened to someone I know and he was quite shaken by it.
These are the questions he asked me:
His final statment was: Now everytime he isn't interested in sex I will wonder. Any comments?
Tom I can't really answer the questions but I can tell you of my own experience. I'm physically attracted only to chubby men. When I met my partner he weighed about 270lbs. After about a year into our relationmship he went on a liquid diet and eventually reduced down to 138lbs. He did it because he thought that it would make him happier. I loved him. And by this time, not just for his body -- I mean, come on. . .at first it's about physical attraction. Because I really was/am in love with him I wanted him to be happy so I went along. Now I've got to tell you, when he got down to 138lbs, I found him physically repulsive -- just as some are repulsed by fatties. However, I never once tried to break his diet nor did I refuse him sex. I'm not trying to preach, but the point is that because of my love for him I was willing to put aside my feelings long enough to empathize with his. It was important for him to do it. And it was important for our relationship for me to let him try. Perhaps the friend in question should just be glad that someone loves him enough to put aside their own feelings and not look a gift-horse in the mouth. These days people break up over toast crumbs in the butter. Clearly, the "friends'" partner is getting something positive out of the relationship. Perhaps the "friends'" partner understands that life is all about trade offs. Just to end my own story -- as soon as my partner went off the liquid diet he gained most of his weight right back. 11 years later, we're still together. What would I have given up if I had left him for a reason based stricktly on physical attraction? I'm not sure that I have, but I hope that I've made some small bit of sense.
Peace & Love,
Tom, (and group) You said: "he was not physically attracted to you but fell in love with you because he liked you as a person?" Comment: Isn't the key word here "LOVE" I know that I have a definite physical type of man that is my ideal and I think most of us, if we tell the truth, would be able to give a physical description of our perfect mate. For me one of the criteria is he must be smooth. Hairy chests just don't do it for me. Now, how do I explain that I love with a man who is a total fuzzball, one of the hairiest men I have ever met, and I can think of nothing so wonderful as to feel his fur against my body and running my fingers (and tongue) through it. He's not my physical type, but he is perfect. This reminds me of a conversation I had with a lesbian friend of mine about a year ago. She was beginning to see a woman who she really liked but, (hmmm I feel that whenever a person uses too many buts in their speech there must be an asshole around) the woman was not her type. Without thinking I blurted out, "But Bonnie, tell the truth, has your type ever worked out?" We both kind of let that sit for a minute and then laughed and both said "No." By the way. They are still together so a change of type can work.
These are the questions he asked me: Can't answer this one, but he did go to bed with your friend and apparently has stayed in that bed, so I would really advise your friend to quit asking questions about the past and live the joy of the moment knowing that he has something special that let his friend transcend the stereotype of the physical ideal and fall in love with him. Would you rather be loved for your body or your mind? For me the answer is simple. My mind. There's an old saying that can be twisted here. Beauty is only skin deep, but ugly is clear to the bone. I, philosophically, come from a belief that I am not my body but am a spirit residing in a body. Should I be in a disfiguring accident or have a debilitating disease, my body would be transformed and I would no longer be me if body were the determining factor, however, the true me, my spirit and personality, would remain constant. So I say love "Me." Is this a compliment, if so why do I feel undesirable? You feel undesirable by choice. I get the idea that your friend is not overly content with his physical type and therefore any comment acts as a reinforcement of his own feelings of undesirability. He is plugging into only one factor and projecting his own feelings and overlooking the statement that he is loved. HE, not just his body. Now every time he isn't interested in sex I will wonder.
I would ask you friend if he wondered why whenever his partner wasn't
interested in sex before the comment was made. No matter how macho we like
to parade ourselves as being and how virile there are times when we are not
really interested in having sex. ( I remember one time about 10 years ago.
dave aka luvhog
Isn't that what LOVE is all about?????????
I have no doubt we'll be together until one of us passes away, and I am
mature enough to know that love is what really counts. I have seen men more
physically attractive to me than my Daddy, but, I would never leave him just
because I find somebody else that is more handsome--I think that would be
really wrong and I'm not that type of person anyway.
We gay people seem to be more into the 'look' part than the 'love' part in a
partner--which I personally think is pretty sad!
Tell this person that looks don't matter as much as true love!!!
David
Hey Tom,
If a guy falls for you because of your "look", guess what... Those looks
change and fade.
At that time, he may be inclined to look for someone with that particular
"look" all over again.
But if someone falls for you because of who you are as a person, a man, then
the chances are good that you might have them in your life for a good long
time.
How lucky he is to have someone fall in love with him for the person that he
IS.
Truth is, we'll probably have hundreds of thousands of orgasms throughout our
life (OK, I can hope), but they don't tend to be the things we remember most
about our relationships.
I believe we remember the way we FEEL when we are with a person with which we
share love. Not the way we look or weather or not we have a six pack or a
pretty nose. These are certainly bonuses for some, of course, but they are
not at the heart of what makes life worth living. Intimacy, affection, love,
kindness, generosity, passion... These things make life worth living IMHO.
Sexual attraction is secondary. Of course it's ideal if we can find both...
but the one who finds love based on the man he is INside, as opposed to the
OUTside, is far and away the more fortunate man in my book.
Having said that, I'll play devil's advocate with myself.... Why would anyone
TELL their partner what your friend's partner said to him? What good did he
expect to come from such a statement? Ouch, and unnecessary.
Terry in KC
Big Joe,
Glad you 'saw the light' and understood that at one time he thought he had
to lose some weight and that you didn't leave him for doing so. At least
some of us have good sense...
I am also in a similar predicament--I am a 'chubbie' and want to lose all of
the extra weight, but, everytime I see somebody I like, they tell me NOT to
change a single thing on my body. I want to please my partners, but, I also
know that is it not healthy to be a big person, and besides, I hate reading
through somebody's ad and reading the dreaded "NO FATTIES" sentence. Little
do they know what we really have to offer, but, like I say, it's THEIR LOSS!
I want to do it for myself, not to please somebody who wouldn't want to have
sex with me for the sole reason of being fat. That's a big turn off anyway,
when a man prefers a person't looks over a person's intellect.
David
Big Joe...
Now, aren't you glad you hung in there? Bet you are.
Harry
------------------------------
David Cantu wrote:
"I am a 'chubbie' and want to lose...weight, but...want to please
my partners,..I...know...it is not healthy"
This is always a predicament for us 'chubby chasers'. Of course the
most important thing in any kind of relationship is the person inside,
irrespective of what's on the outside.
However, physical attraction does play a very important part in mutual
attraction. I personally have always been drawn towards big, chubby
(some may say very fat) men. I can't explain why, it is just something
that lights the fires of passion inside.
Of course I care about the health of any man I am involved with. Being
big does have it's disadvantages, but there are also many, many large
men who live healthy and wholesome lives. Take my two fanatasy guys,
Helmut Kohl and Ed Asner. Both are still physically agile and spritely
despite their girths, and both are over 70 years old.
That's not to say that all big men can go through life without
problems. There is a health risk with carrying extra weight, no doubt
about it.
But I suspect that it has a lot to do with the type of 'bigness' that
makes a large man. Men who are naturally big, i.e. have exactly the
same shape as their parents probably have it in their genes to be that
way. They are also the ones that find it difficult to keep the weight
off after they finish dieting.
Other big men are large through excess eating/ drinking and leading an
inactive lifestyle. With them the weight just piles on over the years,
and with dieting and exercise they could quite successfully lose the
weight and keep it off.
There is also a rather alarming group of people ('gainers and
encouragers') who WANT to put on excess weight and also men who get
turned on by seeing their partner put on weight. This I cannot
understand as it seems little more than the opposite of anorexia.
Also, the pictures I've seen of 'gainers' shows them to have a totally
different shape to a naturally big man. They just don't look natural
to me.
I very much believe that it is our genes as to how and where we put on
weight. My weight is stuck at 140lbs, and has been that way over the
last 16 years. I have a very similar build to my father who also
managed to maintain his physique into his sixties, as does my older
brother. I doubt if I could ever be really big, and none of the males
in my family have ever been large right down the family tree.
Some people quite cruelly say that you never saw any big people in a
Nazi concentration camp, therefore a persons size is down to gluttony.
However, I'd like to add that if you took a group of people from a
concentration camp, fed them the same diet and made them do the same
physical work then they'd all put on weight differently. Our body
shape is determined by age, metabolism and genetic make up, not just
by how much food we eat.
Big men I have known and am attracted to nearly all had a father/
mother with exactly the same build as themselves. In their cases it
seems that their body shape is hereditory.
Never would I discourage a guy from losing weight, but neither would I
encourage him to put it on either. As long as he eats well and is
physically active then I'd be happy with how he was. If he was
naturally big he'd probably keep his round shape anyway.
So I suppose they key questions to ask if you are a big guy are: Do
you eat sensibly and the right foods? And: Do you keep physically
active?
If the answer to both questions is 'Yes' then your shape is probably
hereditory. If the answer to one or both is 'No' then you need to look
at your lifestyle and eating habits which are probably causing weight
gain.
At the end of the day I am no dietician, nor expert on obesity. But I
have met and known enough big guys over the years to have seen
patterns emerging that I have mentioned above.
To lose weight is a decision that should be taken by the individual
concerened. If you want to do it, then go for it. The choice is yours
and you need to decide whether you want to do it for yourself.
It should never be decided by outside pressure, such as a lover who
states 'I want you to be fat/ slim'. You do it for you, and for what
makes you feel good. Afterall, it is your body......
Hugs to everyone, irrespective of size!
Just a comment but you and your mate already know: "Skip the fad diets like
the one he took. Eventually they will do more harm than benefit."
Send him to a gymnasium and put him to lift weights, it won't make him
slimmer but it will make him a solid chubby ;7)
Angel
Of course every Guy wants to hear that His dick is just the right size and
that His Cum is very sweet,,, and that stuff is related to a Man's Ego. Men
are very sensitive; most try to hide their feelings, but All Men want to
think that they Are Cute.
Of course, what Dave said is correct also. Love has a way of working things
out. And it was my experience that after falling in love with a Man, I
usually came to find him more physically attractive.
When I fall out of love with someone, I then always ask myself why I ever
had anything to do with that guy who was so ugly.
So, it is my opinion that love helps to determine how cute you are.... End of silverfoxesclub-digest V1 #164/5
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